my oponion is there is only one god which is the lord jesus and he is not false and for whom ever says he is,is very wrong and shall not get another chance to live immortally. that is my oponion;D

and north wind has the sign of the devil.
but im not here to start a fight but yet just to warn you

[Edited on 17-11-2005 by Masterman.EXE]

Two things to address.

The word or indicates an alternative. The very nature of an alternative is to be another option to one that already exists. However, although another path exists, it does not negate the fact that the other path still exists. Even if you did offer another possible purpose for this discussion, this does not nullify the first suggestion that you made. With this knowledge, it is undeniable that you did state that the purpose of this discussion was for others to prove you wrong. Which then grants one to comment that nothing can be proven by discussion of this nature.

I can\'t say that\'s what you meant, but it is what you said. Given what you did say, there was a valid logical reason to reply that nothing can be proven on this subject.

And secondly, your claim that I ignored the second option is unfounded.



I actually did touch the second option, but did not give it nearly as much attention because it wasn\'t something I disagreed with. I did not, however, neglect the or.



If people are brainwashed..

Or if a god or gods are proven to exist. You can\'t really prove that they don\'t. You can\'t prove that matter wasn\'t created by some god in some fashion.



Yes, and both had the tools do what you described them as doing.

Secondly, on regards to the Edison example - there\'s a difference between discussing whether or not something can happen, and discussing how to do it. There\'s nothing here in this discussion that can be applied to actually prove the existence of gods nor does there seem to be any discussion on as to how. From what I\'ve skimmed everyone just shared what they believed.



Math. ;p

[Edited on 17-11-2005 by Necro]

Thought I\'d do the civil thing and reply to the topic at hand.

Why...do those that do not believe in said God or Gods or Pie always think that the ones who -do- are \"weak minded\"? I suppose because that\'s what is covered most by the media..the morons who aren\'t even Christian but deem themselves so (see Trading Spouses from last week..or was that the week before? ). There\'s not alot of true Christians doing good deeds on the news, because darnit, that just isn\'t good media coverage.



I find it kind of ironic that you won\'t open your mind to different perspectives yourself. :o



Dude, I\'ve thought that was the way it is for who knows how long now.. When you die, that\'s it..nothing left after. It\'s not such a big deal..not too farfetched. And I don\'t see why people would fear it.



I believe that the majority of those people aren\'t true Christians, and were just taught from a young age..\"be good or you will burn in hell/jesus will hate you/etc\". The bible and all the associated was thrown at them, with their impressionable minds. They learn..oh, well I best be good because if I\'m not..the demons will get me. It is just used as a fear tool, and most of them don\'t ever grasp the true concept of Christianity.



I do find it silly how people take solace in death, or the death of loved ones, because they\'re with \"God\" now. But hey, I guess that is nicer than \"well now it\'s time to rot!\" ;D



And some are really stupid. Honestly, SOME people do need a book to tell them not to treat their fellow man like dirt. They aren\'t neccessarily \"weak minded\" or such, though..



Don\'t you think that the person writing the bible may have known that already..? Ooo I feel a drama for Fox coming on.



Sure, but that\'s only because we have an ape in office that \"has God speak to him\". He\'s a nutcase. He shouldn\'t represent the whole religion. Unfortunately he represents alot of America, though.



There is no war... All there is, is the ape in office giving morons a louder voice. Said morons are NOT true Christians..they are full of hate. They just use the Christian moniker as an excuse to spread said hate.



Agreed with you wholly on this one. It\'s terribly backward. So okay..we\'re supposed to follow Christ. The one who was an overdone hippie, who\'s all for peace and love. But whoa..gotta kill those faggots! JESUS HATES FAGS! JESUS WANTS GAY BABIES DEAD (but abortion is a no-no)! It makes no sense. There are plenty of Christians who also believe that it\'s abunch of horse puckey though. Infact, there are a few openly gay Christians here and there.



I dunno if it\'s just me, but I\'d die if I couldn\'t indulge in \'those types of experiences\' if you know what I mean. I read once about a fellow who used to hold a rosary in his hands almost constantly when he was in puberty, to prevent himself from..well, you know. How could someone torture themselves like that..?



Right, but again..they\'re not following their religion as they should, they\'re using it as an excuse. Unless it\'s Muslim..but I dunno, that whole \"kill the infidels\" in the Qu\'ran or however you spell it might be just a rumor of some sort.



Is that Latin? *blinks* I\'m half asleep.



Honestly, I think you\'ve just been watching too much television... Or live in the Bible Belt.



Agreed. Some do use it for comfort. Again you say \"mindless\" though..troll. :o And the fear is usually part of religion, so I don\'t see how they\'d be left in fear without it..



Man, if you were only FOR Christianity..you\'d have your own show on Fox News in a flash.. :rofl:



In actuality they\'d just be going to another religion though..Satanism! I used to be a Satanist. :o And no, not one of those stupid Satan-worshippers..there IS a difference. I also used to go to bible school. And I still go to church on Easter, sometimes (protestant, for those keeping track). I\'m inbetween Agnostic and Atheist yet I\'m more Christian than alot of so-called \"christians\" I\'ve seen. I\'m a big ball of fun.

So anyways.. *whistles*

Well, I think I have to restate that there\'s nothing to accomplish from this. You brought up, WindRider, that the entire Bible, religion, and all things associated with my belief, may simply be the raving of a madman onto paper. This is true, it is a possibility. However, there is also absolutely no reason why this has to be true, nor any other opinion. Because no opinion is any more credible than the other, this is more like a forum game than anything else. We\'re just going to throw words back and forth, and noone\'s going to learn a single thing not involving Necro\'s mythological upbringing. We\'ve already established that no one will change an opinion, and I think everyone\'s pretty well gotten out their opinion. So really, what further reason does such a topic have?

Anyways, it\'s not my place to close these topics, so have at thee!:P If Necro and Breakman don\'t see it fit to do so, I don\'t see why I should either. So disregard... Pretty much everything I just posted.

Not like you all hadn\'t already planned to.

/inferiority complex

[Edited on 17-11-2005 by AimMan v2.5]

Necroism was established pre-2001. I believe I was the second member but I\'m not entirely sure.. It\'s always hilarious when people take it seriously. :o Necroism isn\'t about seriousness, it\'s about being laid back and using a LOT of sarcasm. If anyone says they\'re part of Necroism but act like an irate child who just lost at Halo, well..they\'re not TRUE Necroists.

I still say you were using a wall-hack when I played you.

Hrm... a lot of good points have been brought up, but I have to speak out in defense of one thing- The railing against anti-gay Christians and the \"hatred.\" I know that there are so-called Christians who really do hate these people, and unreasonably so. However, just because you think something is wrong doesn\'t mean that you hate the person who does it. I will openly admit, and probably offend several people in doing so, that I think that homosexuality is unnatural and wrong... And yet, I have no problem being friends with someone who is homosexual, and I don\'t sit around and throw my beliefs back in their face. I think it\'s important to remember that you can dislike what someone does yet still like the person.

-Ri

My first attack on your proposal is that you speak in generalities. I understand the concept of speaking with the scope of multiple religions, but you have to understand is that while most religions have a collective consciousness, they don\'t all say the same things. The basic gist isn\'t complex enough to convey the entire scope of the religion. Therefore, don\'t speak in generalities in a concept that cannot be generalized.

Second, religion wasn\'t started just to be religion. People in the past did NOT think like you, they did NOT view the world in its entirety, and they did NOT see the world as coming down in smoke and flames. They didn\'t come up with religion just so they could instill order. Christianity is far too complex for that, since it involves the scope of over 66 different books compiled into a single collection (THB). Religions get started by people who witness certain things and try to make sense of them. Yes, attack that if you will, but I say that Christianity wasn\'t plotted out (in the manner you suggest) but rather was a series of beliefs and teachings taught by Christ, and refined by his followers. It was NOT made to create order, but rather to lead to Everlasting life, the promise of Christ. And, take note that the people following Christ (including his disciples, the refiners of Christianity no less) all believed in Christ, the Messiah, who would save their souls.

And, lastly, my final attack of criticism is one of ... debatabiliy:

What you consider to be a waste of time in your own eyes does little to define whether or not something is a waste of time. Those people you speak of who spend their times in temple, Mosques, churches, and whatever else are justified in their own minds and their own actions. That is all that matters, and whether or not such activities for you would be considered a waste of time for yourself is immaterial and irrelevant.

In fact, just stating that you think such things are wastes of time is ignorant and selfish, horribly judgmental, and horribly reflective of the human nature which you seem to criticise at every point you make.


Of course, all of this is philosophic rhetoric, but an opinion no less.

plzdie

And oh yeah, Rioni does make a good point, the point I forgot to make. You can hate the sin all you want, but hating the sinner is completely un-Christian. So people who hate gays and use their religion as an excuse to hate them, aren\'t anything near a true Christian.

It\'s kind of ironic how there were tests done, and it was proven that the most homophobic persons had the highest gay tendencies.. Gotta wonder what some of those more vocal anti-homosexual groups do behind closed doors.

Hoobastank? Was Pheonix someone I should know? Or shouldn\'t, for that matter?:conf:

Anyways, you\'re right, you can\'t hate any type of sinners without being hypocritical to your own religion. Not even mass murderers, or anything of the like. Really, you\'re not supposed to hate anything as far as I know, except maybe the temptation of the devil, and fear is still not to be associated there.

You\'re also probably right about homophobes being the most likely to become homosexuals. I mean, the more you know about something, the more likely you are to become it. I try not to be too homophobic.:P

It\'s Kei. Again. Hopefully he\'ll run out of names, he\'s Found a Key right now.



Hahaha yes, people focus on it too much.. That\'s what always gets me about Christians..you\'re supposed to follow Christ. And he himself wouldn\'t have said \"You know, I would look at you objectively if you weren\'t homosexual. But now you are so I have to yell and scream and pray you\'ll get AIDs.\" So people who do said thing, aren\'t Christians.

But I still don\'t know what to call them. :o

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